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wirthi
10-25-2002, 10:51 AM
Hi,

in news://comp.distributed
groups.google.com (http://groups.google.com/groups?dq=&hl=de&lr=&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8&frame=right&th=b1c296e4bbf7565e&seekm=3db171f7.143964019%40news.ox.ac.uk#link1)
there is a thread questioning if this project will find the solution (before the end of the universe).

Anybody knowing if that are facts or just fiction. :confused:

I, personally, see no fun in running a project that will not find a solution.

IronBits
10-25-2002, 10:58 AM
Thanks for sharing your opinion.
I see there are quite a few teams formed already.
Looking at the project site I see there will be a Linux version in several months.
Wonder if it will run under wine?

alpha
10-25-2002, 11:41 AM
Check the 'How are we going to crack the RSA 576 challenge?' section of the FAQ on the website. I read it through but am not sure what to determine from it. It would seem there is a lot of guessing and random numbers involved, so one could assume the solution might never be found?

wirthi
10-25-2002, 12:46 PM
My concern is not about the random algorithm - ECCp was random, and it was solved. What I read in the article is that there is a huge amount of possible solutions that have to be testet. So, no matter if they are testet by random or with a certain system (like d.net's crypto projects), it is unlikely that the solution is found in reasonable time (the article even mentiones "before the end of the universe")

I agree with Kirk Pearson that everybody may freely decide if a project is worth getting donated some cpu power. For me that means that unless anybody can proof that this project takes less than ("lifetime of the universe") to be solved, I won't participate.

PY 222
10-28-2002, 11:04 PM
So, has anyone of you figured out the 64 million dollar question yet?

"Will/Can the RSA 576 project be solved?"

I am just curious.

magnav0x
10-28-2002, 11:35 PM
there is a lot of guessing and random numbers involved

The beta algorithms will most likely be replaced with a better means in the near future. The final release of the Neo client WILL be on November 1st. Thought the current one is already rock solid. For all we know, the number could just pop up tomorrow, so I'm not realy worried whether or not people don't think it'll be solved in the "lifetime of this universe". This is a project that interests me myself. I'd like to see this project completed, and I'll donate my CPU cycles to it for as long as it's around. I just wish more people would take notice of it and stop reading the hype.

wirthi
10-29-2002, 06:03 AM
Ok, I would also be interested in this Project. Anyway, my concern still is that this project won't be solved in reasonable time. Distributed.net members said their RC5-72 will most likeley solved in 5 to 10 years. I haven't heard anything alike from the NEO staff.

Of course the solution could be found tomorrow. But as I mentioned before, it could also be found in 15 Billion Years.

I just wish more people would take notice of it and stop reading the hype.
To make me run the project, convince me that it could be solved in reasonable time.

magnav0x
10-29-2002, 09:37 AM
I didn't say it would be completed in a resonable time.....The RC5-72 project would not be completed in a reasonable amount of time without the hundred thousand or so registered crunchers it usualy recieves when a project comes up. This is an aspect of the project that does not worry me. To be able to finish something, there has to be a start.

wirthi
10-29-2002, 09:56 AM
Of course you are right, d.net's huge userbase makes it possible to solve it much faster than with less users.

Anyway, (I repeate myself) my concern is (according to the usenet-post I mentioned in my first post) that this problem is too huge to be solved, no matter how many participants this project attracts.

Again, I agree with you, if you don't start to do it, you can be sure it won't be solved. I wish the Neo team all the best to solve the problem, but I am almost certain they won't.

And I rather invest my CPU power (and energy bill, etc) in projects that seem more likely to produce useable results (folding@home, etc) or projects that admit they don't know yet if they can reach their goals (like distributedfolding).

That's just my personal opinion. Don't let it affect your enthusiasm of working (for) the Neo project :)

IronBits
10-29-2002, 10:01 AM
There is nothing wrong with having short term goals :D
I like em that way most of the time :p
I like this client so far... the project just started, so I'm not concerned about the ending yet. ;)
Crunch on, what ever project you may be on, that's the most important part. :cheers:
Thanks for lifting your head up from your current projects to look around to see what everyone else is doing ;) :smoking:

Digital Parasite
11-02-2002, 05:45 PM
Hi everyone,

You were asking about the likelyhood of this project ever finding a solution. Sadly, there is a good chance that this project will never finish in a reasonable amount of time. As mentioned in the comp.distributed thread, the only reasonable algorithm to do this is the GNFS.

There is a new project starting up soon that will use the GNFS (http://www.nfsnet.org/) but they do not plan to do RSA-576.

I have emailed Mike a couple of times about my concerns over the project and have not received a response. My concern was not that they were trying to solve a problem in an infeasable way but that it is hard to tell from the information on the web site that the project may never find a solution to the problem. People may be signing up for this and donating their CPU time without realizing it may never be solved. I'm all for people doing whatever they want with their CPU time whether some people think it makes sense or not but I think they should at least be given enough facts to make the choice themselves.

Using their "chaos theory" algorithm, numbers are chosen at random which means the magic number may never be selected. There could also be a lot of duplicated work of people testing the same random values. At least with brute-forcing the 576bit key you will eventually find the solution. There is no real way to measure how much computing is required to find the solution or how far along you are in the project.

It is great to see these guys interested in DC and want to do work that will benefit people and charities so I hope they keep with it and offer other projects as well that have a better chance of finishing.

Jeff.