Reply With QuoteI just noticed the sieve coordination thread says 1m-20m so that's obviously the range.
I've started working on a PHP/mySQL based sieve co-ordinator, basically I just need to know the total range that we are sieving and what ranges have been completed and reserved.
Also anything that you particularly want mentioned say here and i'll try and do it. I should have something up and running soon but I'll need someone to check through things and make sure they look right.
I just noticed the sieve coordination thread says 1m-20m so that's obviously the range.
Matt not really...
The sieve range is based on p we are/will sieve from p=0 to p=1126T with proth.
What you want to do is script reservations based upon G intervals of p.
Range reservations are generally
example,
805000-806000 Name [Reserved] (dat)
As you can see in the co-ordination thread...
What I would suggest is some type of pull where your script automatically determines the lowest p available, then you could specify how much your like to sieve in G. And it would automatcially make your reservation for you...
In addition to the above you would want to include a comment field where people could add in things like: (ETA: Sept 15, with 991<n<50M dat)
Also you may wish to download the excel file, it would be great if you had a pull down menu of computer type which would estimate speed and then give an estimate of days to complete.
So here is what you could have....
Two seperate scripts....
Choose processor which most closely resemebles yours
-athlon xp 1800, pentium3-1000MHz, barton XXX, Athlon 64 etc..
It would give a rough estimate of kp/s which a first time usre to transfer to another box or over write if they knew their sieve speed.
Second a box for how long you'd like to sieve...
Based upon the above two choices it would recommend a sieve range*, I.E. 500G
It would take this 500G and auto enter it into another box which people could overwrite if they wish.
Then enter their username'...
Then enter any comments...
The script would then look for the lowest p 805000 for example add 500 to it and reserved based upon their info.
Lowest-p (from table), -, [Lowest-p (from table) + {Calculated Range}*], username', comments
805000-805500 username comments
Whatever you decide please don't limit the current functions that we have.
It's pretty much done. See it at http://mattford.org.uk/sob
User accounts are already set up for anyone who's done sieving before, you'll need to contact me to get a password.
Feedback requested as to what isn't working properly or what needs to be added or changed.
As it stands at the moment here is the proccess for sieving:
[list=1][*]Go to the site[*]Register if you haven't already got an account setup[*]Log in[*]Go to the reserve a range page[*]Choose a range size or get the calculator to work one out for you[*]Choose where you want to work[*]Reserve your range[*]Sieve. You can log in and update your progress using the comments and factors fields.[*]When the sieve is complete submit all your work in the normal way then mark your range as complete.[*]An admin then confirms that the range has indeed been completed and submitted to the server, and that the number of factors found is accurate.[/list=1]
You can reserve any number of ranges but the maximum range size is 1000G.
Ahh Matt sorry now I know what the PM was about...
WOW!!! That's great and well done... few issues however.
First I reserved a range to test the system but could not find a way to unreserve or abandon the range.
Couple things
Reserved tests
Pending tests should all be changes to Ranges, since we are actually doing ranges.
Second after the Min and Max add (G)
Min (G)
Max (G)
On the calculator That's really really great I like it but there are few problems...
You can't simply enter your sieve speed and have it calculate the range you have to choose a particular processor. Choosing the processor is great for first timers give you a rough guess etc, I think the date ranges are perfect.
Few more
There is no way of reserving a particular range Min Max or your choosing? Also would it be possible to add the comment earlier in the range reservation as opposed to once a range is reserved edit later? I just have a feeling less people will use the comment field the way it is.
I do like the fact that you can edit your range after comments etc, but you can't edit pmin pmax, maybe this is a good thing unsure currently.
I think this is really really good but with some feedback it could be fantastic.
Let some others try it out for a while...
I've changed "test" to range in the most obvious places, I'll do the other things later on tonight hopefully.
Ok, I've made a few changes to the calculator, now when you select a processor speed it fills out the kps straight away as a guide. Then you can change it if you like, then choose a period and have it work out a range. You can now also enter a custom min value. You can also comment on a range as you reserve it. I haven't allowed users to extend or shrink ranges as it could quite easily lead to overlaps, however I may implement it later. A test username has been set up, log in with username "test" and password "test". I've added the (G) to all places I can see that need it, if I've missed any let me know. Users can also abandon ranges now.
Very big improvments I hope others try this out... I do have a few more comments and suggestions...
1.
I think I snafu'ed the table with a high-n reservation you may wish to check this...
2.
I tried to trick the table asking for a range within a range...
571000-571500
It came back with
IMHO, this is perfect
YOUR RANGE WAS SHORTENED TO PREVENT AN OVERLAP!
You have been resereved the following range:
min: 571000
max: 571000
3.
It's always easier for users when they have a small comments around what they are doing...
Range Size Calculator
This is great but I would comment:
Suggests Range Size for reservation based upon CPU and time commitment.
Also I believe Range Size Calculator should be located above "Choose A Range Size"
4.
"Choose A Range Size" shouldn't this actually be "Reserve a range"
That's basically what your doing...
And of course the button should be reserve range.
5.
The gap radio button is great!!!
6.
Also the abandon range works very well.
P.S. The admin side looks good to but I couldn't figure out how to delete someones range. Let leave the admin side for now and get a couple other to beta test.
Nice work.
A few comments.
You can add:
A range size column and factors per G column in related tables.
A range size column for gaps on reservation page.
Maximum range size would better be 10000G. There are some users who prefer to reserve in 2000G, 5000G and 10000G batches.
For the time being, I think you can limit the upper limit of avaliable ranges to 2^50 (i.e. 1126120G).
How about a two way calculator? Select processor and time span, and it will give you the recommended size of range to be selected. Or, select processor and range size, and it will give you how long that range will take. Or, a third option: Select the processor and it will give you estimated time to finish for a couple of range sizes as a list and by clicking the related range size, you will automatically reserve first available range of that size. It will look like below:
100G will finish in 4 days and 2 hours. Click to reserve first available 100G range of xxxxxxG-yyyyyyG
200G will finish in 8 days and 4 hours. Click to reserve first available 200G range of xxxxxxG-yyyyyyG
500G will finish in 16 days and 8 hours. Click to reserve first available 500G range of xxxxxxG-yyyyyyG
1000G will finish in 32 days and 16 hours. Click to reserve first available 1000G range of xxxxxxG-yyyyyyG
2000G will finish in 65 days and 8 hours. Click to reserve first available 2000G range of xxxxxxG-yyyyyyG
5000G will finish in 130 days and 16 hours. Click to reserve first available 5000G range of xxxxxxG-yyyyyyG
10000G will finish in 261 days and 8 hours. Click to reserve first available 10000G range of xxxxxxG-yyyyyyG
One can shorten this of course. I just could not find how.
Last edited by Nuri; 05-19-2005 at 04:09 PM.
Ok, I think I have implemented most of those improvements you've suggested. I see this user: http://mattford.org.uk/sob/userinfo.php?user=57 has a very high range reserved, I think I got this from one of the sieve co-ordination forum threads when I imported everything in - is this wrong? I'm guessing it must be as the numbers are 100x larger than what we're dealing with...
EDIT: Posted this whilst nuri was posting so haven't done those changes yet, I'll look into them now.
Matt,
Ranges way up there are possible just not with the current most popular software.
Proth which is what 99.9% of the people use 100% of the time is limited to 1125895
or there abouts.
Basically the largest range that should be reserved is less than
1120000 1125850 pixl97 [complete]
So you could use 1120000 as a cut off for the radio buttons (Gaps).
_______________
O.K. now I'm really pushing it but is gap the correct term? (I don't know)
I think it is... "Gaps" in reservations
"holes" are portions where no factors were found?
I think Matt has it correct, it's really semantics on this level anyways.
_______________
I like Nuri's suggestions for the three-way calculator I already made one with the excel sheet a while back... does anyone use it?
I think what's important for the calculator portion is what would a newbie use most. I think they would at least know which processor they have and how long they would like to commit. So Nuri's suggestion of
after they select a processor type would be great.100G will finish in 4 days and 2 hours. Click to reserve first available 100G range of xxxxxxG-yyyyyyG
200G will finish in 8 days and 4 hours. Click to reserve first available 200G range of xxxxxxG-yyyyyyG
500G will finish in 16 days and 8 hours. Click to reserve first available 500G range of xxxxxxG-yyyyyyG
1000G will finish in 32 days and 16 hours. Click to reserve first available 1000G range of xxxxxxG-yyyyyyG
2000G will finish in 65 days and 8 hours. Click to reserve first available 2000G range of xxxxxxG-yyyyyyG
5000G will finish in 130 days and 16 hours. Click to reserve first available 5000G range of xxxxxxG-yyyyyyG
10000G will finish in 261 days and 8 hours. Click to reserve first available 10000G range of xxxxxxG-yyyyyyG
We really don't want alot of people reserving in 632G increments correct?
What I would suggest is what nuri point suggested... (Nuri did you see the radio button on the left?) [Default to lowest range]
Except replace
10000G will finish in 261 days and 8 hours. Click to reserve first available 10000G range of xxxxxxG-yyyyyyG
With:
(Radio button) Click to reserve 10000G Range, will complete in 261 days and 8hrs.
Then the final radio button would be the custom range size reservation.
I think this is looking very good. Thanks for doing all of this work Matt.
Matt: I linked this thread in the current reservations thread... hopefully we can get more people looking commenting...
Can you please please please make a comment on the opening page that your page is still beta and range reservations there have no influnence or impact on the *OFFICIAL RESEVATION THREAD*.
I've done a few changes not sure if it's exactly what you meant but it's something along the lines of it. Combination of javascript and PHP as javascript was doing my head in too much
Probably still needs a bit of fine tuning so let me know what you think.
Matt
I think you got it!!!
I say sit back and wait for people to comment a little more.
I've worked through it a couple times and I think it's fantastic you hit the nail right on the head with the range calculations.
We need some fresh eyes to look at it.
Perfect for me!!!
I had NO problem reserving 3 ranges and abandoning one.
I have no complaints, it was simple, straight forward and SLICK!
I created the 1st one, using the CPU method, but it didn't have an AMD FX55 listed so I chose the AMD64 3000, put in 768 kp/s and let it figure it out.
I was able to understand it
I would like to see ...
After I select a range of say 1000 G
[ ] Assign me a range that is best for the project now!
or / and
[ ] Plug a hole! We'll give ya something to work on.
Larger FONTS would be nice, after all, it's important numbers!
good work.
Few comments by a real sieving beginner(never done some)
1)One should not have access to the pending test page while logged out. Neither to the Completed Ranges section. When logged in, it could be 'Your pending ranges', etc., too. Easier to understand.
2)One should not be able to reserve a range of 192 or so. The calculator should just say: 192 will take one week, I suggest 200 (7.3days). Something like this.
3)No radio button for Ranges that take an eternity (10000G on Pentium 133).
4) A beginners section with links to the software, the submission page and some explanations could be helpful.
5)Bug(?): When logging out, it says:'Logged out', but in the upper part of the page, still 'You are logged in as test ' . Then I click again on Log out and it is fine. Same thing when logging in again.
6) It says:'You have been reserved the following range:
min: 807703
max: 807803'
But one more line would be helpful, with just the command line for the console. (Correct me if I tell bullshit, I never sieved).
I think that's all for the moment.
As for the rest, really great, thank you, Matt.
See you, H.
Edit: I don't know whether or not a box where you can check that you are using the large dat is useful...people eventually check it without using it, thinking it is better; on the other hand, it turns out quickly that they lied when no factors are found... H.
actually futher to hhh's idea
an option to download your reserved range as a nextrange.txt file would be good.
We had a poll some time ago if we should make an advertisement for sieving on the main page of www.seventeenorbust.com. It said no. I think, given the new circumstances, we should relance this poll, once the new reservation script released in its nonbeta version.
Sieving is an essantial part of the process/project, and if it looks official, we can make it official, too, I think. (my opinion, at least).
H.
Not entirely sure on the format of the nextrange file, can someone give me an example please? I'll carry on working through your suggestions as best I can.
Also the request about "best for the project" how would I work out where the best place to sieve is?
I have decided for the time being not to require login to view pending or completed ranges sections. For a start this could be easily curcumvented by using the test login or buy registering for an account and also I don't really see that it's nessecary.
The pending ranges section now has a link to the users "view your ranges" section.
The calculator only recommends block sizes that will finish within 90 days. It also only recommends range sizes in blocks of 10G unless the user specifies a custom block size.
I've added a little bit of info to the front page about where to get the software etc. it's not very detailed so if someone wants to help me pad it out I'd be grateful.
I've fixed the small bug in the log in/out pages.
Not entirely clear on what was meant about the type of DAT being used. Do you want a field in the database or some way of checking which is the most up to date DAT file?
Last edited by Matt; 05-20-2005 at 12:57 PM.
Ironbits, thanks for checking it out,
The default is already set for what's best for the project, not sure if that's clear.Assign me a range that is best for the project now!
Layout...
The page is sort of broken into two halves the left side basically pertains to the "I'm not sure what I want calculate it for me" and the right hand side which is really the reservation portion.
Right hand side I love the calculator sepecially for the calculate range size by time. Enter 3 days yeild 86G. But then it brings up 100G in 3.5 days (this is really really perfect!!!)
Here's the suggestion...
Move the left hand side below the right hand side, maybe use a horizontal line seperating from the top, etc. Move the custom min from that location to elsewhere, I think the best place for it would be the bottom of the select a working area (good term BTW).
Second location of the calculated ranges with the use buttons. Have the location of the use buttons pop-up (fill in) below the CPU/Time fields and above the reservations section.
I have an edit suggestion then as well...
thenIf you know what range size you want, skip to the bottom "reserve a range" , enter it and choose a working area (optimal range is by default)
to give you either a time prediction or a range size recommendation pressing use will transfer your selection to the reservation box. Comment on your range if you so desire.
Good work Matt alot of people like this!!!
Second comment to Matt on the next file etc....
Once a range has been calculated your put on a screen that shows this...
Could you change the format to the followingYou have been reserved the following range:
min: 807803
max: 807935
You have been reserved the following range:
807803-807935 username [reserved] (comments)
Now the nextrange.txt file is easy...
Below this have it display the following two lines
pmin=807903000000000
pmax=807935000000000
no bold of course.
People who knew could then cut and paste this into a txt file called named nextrange.txt, would you like me to write an instructions?
If it were possible you could have a link or button download nextrange.txt file.
Does this help?
I've done the nextrange thing and moved around the reservation page yet again. I'm still not happy with the layout of this page, I'm considering maybe a "simple" mode and an "advanced" mode? Simple mode could basically be the calculator and advanced mode you enter your own block size and have the option to choose a custom min. What do you think?
I like this idea, but could you use a check box to activate it instead? Those of us with farms of computers and Sobistrator don't need it.Originally posted by ShoeLace
actually futher to hhh's idea
an option to download your reserved range as a nextrange.txt file would be good.
Stromkarl
The nextrange.txt file is incorrect it basically comes accross as
pmin=807935000000000(symbol)pmax=808935000000000
where is should be a new line
pmin=807935000000000
pmax=808935000000000
I really suggest that you add the pmin= in the reserve.php screen a cut and paste is what I would use personally as opposed to a download.
You have been reserved the following range:
min: 808935
max: 809435
___________________________________
I kind of like the page as it is but the advanced mode etc sounds interesting...
The current page could be the advanced mode
Perhaps just the top left hand side could be the simplified, change the comments
Choose your range size. An athlon xp2500 will sieve about 50G per day.
Need help choosing a range (more/less time, different computer) click here, range calculator click here, advanced reservations click here etc.
The nextrange.txt works for me, it's possible that it's using the unix newline character instead of the windows newline character. I'll change the ouput to have it in the format required for a nextrange.txt file.
Once you reserve the range.
The
pmin=809445000000000
pmax=810445000000000
is perfect but to avoid confusion you really need to use the format of the old thread as well. Those are also the numbers that you would enter if your a first timer too.
809445-810445 username comment
or at least,
You have successfully reserved the range 809445-810445 somewhere
I've changed it a little, is that OK?
Wow! This thread is hot...
Check the reserved ranges . . . something strange is going on:
805000 805500 hc_grove May 21, 2005
805000 805865 VJS May 19, 2005
and on the gap page:
GAP: 805500 -> 805000
Last edited by OverlordQ; 05-21-2005 at 08:57 AM.
I just tried to view the [Completed Ranges] page. I am connected with DSL and it took forever! Is there a way to break down the stats for this into separate pages or to have a drop down list with how many entries to show per page?
Also, the site seemed slow to load. Would it be possible to have a stat for how many people are currently browsing the reservation pages, sort of like the forum does?
These are just nit-picky points, but may help the page go faster. As for content, it is great! I did notice that the gap page showed that there was a gap that went backwards at the beginning. This had to do with an overlapping reservation.
Keep up the good work!
Stromkarl
Last edited by Stromkarl; 05-21-2005 at 10:02 AM.
Ok, the reason for the overlap is because I manually inserted the test by hc_grove as it was entered into the sieve co-ordination thread, I didn't check if it was overlapping which was a bit silly. I never notice the page load because the server is on my LAN. The site is running off my home ADSL connection which only has 256k/s upload. I do have a proper webhost somewhere that I could use or if someone else wants to host it that's ok, basically all it needs is PHP/mySQL, and I would prefer phpMyAdmin to help me with various tweaking bits.
yea it might be mentioned that if people reserve ranges on the site to still post it in the thread to keep this from happening.
perhaps the auto reserving should just skip ahead or have a specific range that it reserves through then reserve that whole range off the bat in the reservations thread to allow everyone to know not to reserve in that range.
Well hopefully the thread and the site will not be running in parallel for too long.I hope we are in agreement that the site is a better system (otherwise I've wasted my time) and hopefully it can come out of BETA soon (I haven't made any changes to it for a day or so).
Are there any news from MikeH?
I guess it's important that reservation site and sieve stat site can communicate without manual intervention.
It'd be nice to hear his comments as well.
I've comunicated with him via PM and have set up a channel of data transfer from my co-ordination site to his stats site.
If and when everyone (especially SoB creators) agree that this site will serve as the sieve co-ordination page what we will do is the following.
Either Lock the main site co-ordinating tread the a direct link to Matt's url or hosting so no one can reserve there.
or
Reserve a large block say 800000-850000 in the main thread as "automatic sieve reservation" and I will manually update ranges for a few weeks.
One of these options will probably work. Also the main reservation thread will not dissappear. I'd suggest that we keep the thread for achieve purposes at least. This would also off load Matt's site.
Matt have you considered dumping all ranges say <300000, simply link them as achieved. Might speed things up considerably.
Disscussion moved...
From Matt
Can people please try and keep the sieve co-ordinator site up to date as well to save me importing all the data again when it comes out of beta?
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