Windows 7 - you going to switch?

[gopher_yarrowzoo]

I'm installing it now. What the hell, the machine has had Vista Business 32bit on it for so long and is stable enough, I wanted to go to a 64bit OS on there anyhow, this way I do it for free (for now).

My biggest gripe with Vista after using it for so long is that when it wants to do updates, if I ignore them, the machine starts acting pretty odd. I've had the network driver stop working, drive associations disappear etc etc. Do the updates, reboot and all is magically fixed. I'm probably just paranoid though...

Bok

No Bok I don't think your paranoid, it's the new "Please Reboot" message
remember XP's update "Reboot Required" every 5 minutes!

[Bok]

Installed. Got Firefox installed and itunes busy importing my library now (which is on a separate machine).

BOINC 6.6.0 X86_64 is installed and it picked right up from my backup of the program_data directory.

Seems just fine so far, no problems. It autoconfigured my dual 22" display at 1680X1050 (each) which I thought would be the biggest pain.

So far, so good.

[LAURENU2]

Ok that did It I am going to send all my PC's to Bok to Setup
He has the magic touch

[Shish]

Well I gave up on Vista at the 3rd try as even without the fancy bits, it was pitta to sort out the way I wanted and still a memory hog whichever way you run it and not really suited to my present dual AMDs with 1 Gb. They also gutted it of the new things I was waiting for after they ran into problems so there wasn't any point in running anything but 2K3 and XP SP2.
However, after around 2 years of install and messing it up with progs installing and uninstalling, my current XP is ready to fail so I'm downloading Win7 to give it a go when I'm ready (couple months) to upgrade the 3 main systems in the house just now. 2 of them aren't crunchers but do need a good server type architecture for video storeage and serving so I'll give it a try as I still haven't had much spare time in a conscious and brain steady state recently and have had to concentrate most of my physical and mental resources on other peoples problems, as usual. And that's my excuse for also not getting to grips with Linux after not using Nix for many years. It's also a lot quicker to just keep a standardised XP backup image as my prog use doesn't change that much and upgrades don't realy change much or haven't for around 5 years.

[Chuck]

Bok and all,
When I found 6.2.15 was x86_64 mode, I installed it from Berkeley. It has since been released as packaged boinc-client and boinc-manager... and BOY are they stable. There wasn't a blink at all.

As for displays + audio + drives, etc... it all auto configured and I just 'tweaked' a few settings to my preferences, but the default install was 100% usable! I have dual 21's for displays (DVI-A) and have had FF since day 1.

My XP sits idle... this is a Linux house with 2K in VirtualBox and THAT is how i stole Eon from Lauren that one day.... a meer 17 Ghz of cpu power on Linux.

Let's do the Linux switch.... can we ? The government is!!!

C.

Installed. Got Firefox installed and itunes busy importing my library now (which is on a separate machine).

BOINC 6.6.0 X86_64 is installed and it picked right up from my backup of the program_data directory.

Seems just fine so far, no problems. It autoconfigured my dual 22" display at 1680X1050 (each) which I thought would be the biggest pain.

So far, so good.

[Bok]

Chuck,

I'm a linux admin (and solaris/AIX/Dynix etc in past lives for that matter), but I'm all for whatever fits the needs If it weren't for windows, then probably 90% of people would not be using PC's. I see that and accept it, no issue..

As for my win 7 experience so far, only problem I've found up to now is that the screensaver/monitor shutdow refuses to happen for some reason. I'm having to manually switch off my two monitors. Minor I guess, I'll work on it tomorrow.

Oh, and Putty Connection Manager didn't install correctly :P (again, minor - probably because it needs .NET and didn't figure out it wasn't installed)

And I, personally, much prefer CentOS to Fedora any day, though I happen to know quite a few people at RedHat which is after all, just up the road from me

Bok

[Chuck]

Bok,
Thank you... you point out an interesting aspect... Windows is what made PC's popular. I will agree to that whole heartedly. I have not had the liberty to try CentOS, therefore having been a Redhat user since the late 90's, and Sun before that (since 82) and Honeywell/Data General before that. I will admit I probably am biased to some degree as I know what to expect and how to handle issues before they become issues. But, having Linux NOT find a device driver has not occured on ANY of my boards.
I have heard at LOT about CentOS (all good) , just as I have experienced some nightmares with Gentoo.
So your point is well taken and I should strive to be 100% objective and give it a try as well as the others.
I do have first hand experience with Vista. I was quite disappointed even after Updates were applied. A well known manufacturer included Vista as their 'preload' on the laptop. The laptop was loaded with max RAM. It was not a low end machine (4GB DDR2). They ended up offering XP 'downgrade' to which I had this particular laptop converted. It's now running quite well. The laptop is 4 months old.

My experience with Fedora, since both the 'Redhat' days of 1999 on P-III's and K6-2s , through FC-5 and now on FC-8 has been a positive one, without incident, until the recent key-issue at the Redhat facility. I did try FC-9 and was quite disappointed when using X86_64 mode. The issue there is simply logistics. Not enough people to shake out any potential issues before it is declared Karma 4 and/or released as beta/production/whatever.

Since the key incident, the updates have been on track and new keys are updated into the repositories as required with the software updates. My 6.2.15 install of the Fedora packages was flawless.

In the end, I do agree and I cannot argue with in any way....whatever gets the job done.

I would like to see us, (meaning the US) have a stronger Linux base, but perhaps I am asking for too much too soon.

Regardless of 'best choice OS', I hope things work out and all this horsepower which we have at our disposal can be fully utilized.

If I seemed too Anti-MS and too Pro-Linux, I apologize. It is a problem I deal with almost daily. My current task is to complete the transition from an MS base in my work world to a Linux base (a huge task). I may indeed, and ask you to please forgive, any overzealous desire to see a unified community at some level.

With great thanks
C

[gopher_yarrowzoo]

yes Windows is popular but IF we could port DirectX to linux I believe that most if not all the games would run as they simply make calls to the DirectX framework, okay maybe a few minor changes involved probably end up with smaller code, I wonder if the MAC version of the game I play would work in Linux... if so they it would prove it's possible...

What has happened is MS has lost it's focus, where it used to be way back when, all it sees now is $$$$ signs and it's big enough to get away with it.

[the-mk]

What has happened is MS has lost it's focus, where it used to be way back when, all it sees now is $$$$ signs and it's big enough to get away with it.

Happens with every successful company... even mine... how to bring new shiny features to conquer new markets to make more profit instead of taking care of the quality... I hate it...

<-- BTW: nice new icon I discovered

[Chuck]

Gopher,
Yes, the DirectX api would be nice as it would make the game developers FLOCK to linux. The normal port from Windows -> X-win is difficult given the two APIs are 180 degrees out of phase with each other.

As for MAC (unix) -> Linux, It's not as difficult UNLESS they are using proprietary MAC 'tweaks'. Otherwise the X-win API is the same (unless they modified the Xserver as well in the last rev or 2, which I doubt)

We have done basic Mac <-> Linux 64 bit apps 100% and except for the GTK toolkit, everything is fine... MAC's version of GTK is more robust and outright gorgeous, but look at their desktop.... it makes Gnome or KDE look like Win 3.1 LOL . (Look at BT support for BT client 'Transmission' as a currently active project supporting both MAC and Linux.... transmissionbt.org or transmissionbt.com. Linux is lean & mean, Mac's is a work of art. But, point being, it's the same core code and same core UI. All source IS available and users are invited to compile/build on their machines for optimum performance. I believe this would give us a VERY fair measure of what we are looking at in comparing the Win 7 vs OS X vs Linux 'bloat flactors' and porting issues.

I will ask a few 'die-hard' Mac engineers about the DirectX emulation / crossover -> MAC and/or Linux and see what their experiences have been. Personally I see only a licensing / copyright issue as the show-stopper... Anyone with experience PLEASE jump in here.... I would VERY much like to know more details but as I undestand it, Computational tasks are a snap, Device driver depending apps (aka GPU) are one level tougher, and finally, the real-time Gaming world is the toughest.... However, I do wonder what the CUDA standards will do for all of this. Info *IS* invited.

Anyone who has intimate knowledge of the different GTK versions, please also speak up... I believe that is where the issues are / will be.


I am departing TDY and will be offline as of about 1400GMT Fri (tomorrow as I write this)

I will catch you all upon arrival and successful setup with the wifi network. Please forgive my reply delays.



With thanks,
Catch you in a few days.
C.

yes Windows is popular but IF we could port DirectX to linux I believe that most if not all the games would run as they simply make calls to the DirectX framework, okay maybe a few minor changes involved probably end up with smaller code, I wonder if the MAC version of the game I play would work in Linux... if so they it would prove it's possible...

What has happened is MS has lost it's focus, where it used to be way back when, all it sees now is $$$$ signs and it's big enough to get away with it.

[Digital Parasite]

And I, personally, much prefer CentOS to Fedora any day, though I happen to know quite a few people at RedHat which is after all, just up the road from me

CentOS is just a re-packaged RedHat OS so how could you like it *more*? I mean yum points to a different repository by default but... Or do you mean you like the RHEL/CentOS 5 versions than the more cutting-edge Fedora 10?

I know what you mean, I have CentOS 5.x as my server as home, I play with Fedora at work which can be useful when you need the latest stuff, but not as stable and generally more problems.

[Bok]

yes, that's exactly what I mean..

[IronBits]

CentOS 5.2 is required for the P45 chipset to be recognized 'out of the box' ...
don't ask...

Vista 64 bit is stable, pretty darn fast to, if you bother to tweak it so that
1) it doesn't choke on local area network because of auto-discovery/compresssion thing.
2) disable UAC immediately
3) Buy all the latest and greatest computer components if you enjoy plug n pray
4) It appears to bog down now and again, but figures itself out and does well again.

My new Vista 64 Ultimate - game box

ASUS P6T Deluxe LGA 1366 Intel X58 ATX Intel Motherboard
CORSAIR XMS3 12GB (6 x 2GB) 240-Pin DDR3 SDRAM DDR3 1333 (PC3 10666)
SILVERSTONE OP1000-E 1000W ATX 12V 2.2 & EPS 12V
Intel Core i7 920 Nehalem 2.66GHz 4 x 256KB L2 Cache 8MB L3 Cache LGA 1366 130W Quad-Core Processor
Noctua NH-U12P SE1366 CPU Cooler
ASUS ENGTX295/2DI/1792MD3/A GeForce GTX 295 1792MB Video Card
Cooler Master RC-932-KKN1-GP HAF 932 Chassis - 12 Bays - Black

Go into BIOS,
turn off SpeedStep
Change timing from AUTO to Manual
Set BCLK to 177 (front side bus)

Change cpu volts from 1.3 to 1.2
Save settings, reboot

8 cpu Cores running at 3.5GHz