Outlnder joining

[Mustard]

I just don't think it is right for outlnder to be #1 on Free-DC's teams when he didn't contribute anything to Free-DC. His Free-DC team total should be 0 until he has contributed fro Free-DC.

Surely you didn't think that BOINC was perfect did you?????
There's lots of warts with the system, but that's what it is. Unfortunately as Bok said, there isn't any reasonable realistic way to handle this within the confines of the system design.

[alpha]

Surely you didn't think that BOINC was perfect did you?????
There's lots of warts with the system, but that's what it is. Unfortunately as Bok said, there isn't any reasonable realistic way to handle this within the confines of the system design.

Actually, I don't think BOINC or any of the project scoring is at fault here. I think credits attributed to you under a particular team should stay with that team if/when you move. The alternative has been used on non-BOINC projects in the past and I remember lots of incidents where things got messy.

I do see JohnWayne's point though, but if there's no easy way to solve it as Bok already suggested then we'll just have to live with it and move on. Surely outlnder is just another target to aim for, even if his Free-DC scores thus far are only virtual?

[Paratima]

Me votes with alpha on this one. You can argue the point thing either way and believe me, it's been beaten to death and then some. What's done is done. And yeah, the system's a bit strange, but we can live with it. Heh, I was sure surprised when he "appeared" ahead of me in Poem@Home.

Outlnder is only continuing an old tradition. Free-DC was started by escapees from Ars looking for a less stressful environment.

Welcome, outlnder. Good ta see ya! If you stay, that's cool. If you decide to move on, we'll adjust. There's precedent either way.

[Shish]

I'll third that and other comments from all.
As a long time DC'er from RC whatever and Seti and an escapee to the more peaceful but not less argumentative (free and frank discussions?) climes of Free-DC from my only other site of Ars and old enough to remeber 1200/75 bit modem international calls to US numbered BBS and huge telephone bills I appreciate the argument but when you sign up to a project on whatever system you do it or not as free will and according to their rules. Causes a lot of controversy sometimes and keeps a lot of sites running but them's the way DC works and some people like one system of DC some like another but we all appreciate the give and take that ensues with as little acrimony as possible (especially now I'm getting old or summat but not too cranky ).
Nice to see Outlinder and all other members old and new.
Sorry for my lack of contribution of late with both comments and actual results, which no doubt some will not miss, but my involvement with life, health the universe et alles is interfering with my passions and my computers remain in lockdown whilst it's all change in every other respect of my life which is taking a little while longer than expected.
Greetings to all and good health, wealth and happiness. Not too easy working from a new Android phone but do-able as warranted so while I may show as logged in sometimes, I may not actually be online but always available via email without which I still can't force myself to lose
Best and kind regards to all at Free-DC and to Bok especially for his continued forbearance and work here despite him being an ex-pat Sand Dancer Geordie

[JohnWayne]

So if someone wanted to be very industrious and add up all the Ars contributors points in a project that outlnder participated in, they would not get the teams stated totals, they would get a total minus outlnder's points? correct??

Is it possible to rename the acoount at Ars, "retired-outlnder" or "retro-outlnder" or "moved-outlnder" or maybe just "ghost accounts"?? And then when that person moves to another team, he would have 0 cobblestones.

There should be a place holder with those points visible, not just counted but not not seen.

[gopher_yarrowzoo]

Yes but that is the point Bok was trying to make it would and has done in the past made the stats DB look messy and not just here on the individual project Stats output you any idea how many rows are involved for just the live stats as it's not a table per project *which is possible but plain stupid* but 1 table with 1 row per user per project holding the last 28 days of data
now do math - I think the last time I looked it was heading for if not beyond 6 million rows which isn't actually that much if you divide it up by the projects / users involved..
I helped redevelop the stats interface and so I know a lot of what goes on behind not the scripts that do the loading of the DB, I leave that to the experts AMDave n Bok ..
So say "outlndr" leaves Ars-Tech (been there I eject too)..
unless the individual project actually TRACKS this and stores it and exports that store in a "team export stats file" or the like we ain't going to track it as messy ain't the word.. I mean we do track team joiners and leavers but only when they join / leave not what stats they bring in..(no way to 0 the score)
Hmm I'm done here if that doesn't either A) explain it or B) confuse the hell out of him I don't know what will.

[Bok]

So if someone wanted to be very industrious and add up all the Ars contributors points in a project that outlnder participated in, they would not get the teams stated totals, they would get a total minus outlnder's points? correct??

Is it possible to rename the acoount at Ars, "retired-outlnder" or "retro-outlnder" or "moved-outlnder" or maybe just "ghost accounts"?? And then when that person moves to another team, he would have 0 cobblestones.

There should be a place holder with those points visible, not just counted but not not seen.

All of it is *possible* but highly intricate. We would, in effect be 'hacking' the data from the xml stats and I want to avoid that. Putting it plainly though I try to record everything but in the end I want the stats to reflect exactly how the projects show them and because the projects only export one set of statistics per user in their current team that is how it is shown.

Seventeen or Bust and Folding@Home are the only projects I know of where you actually have separate users when you switch teams. Both are nonBOINC and it makes the external stats rather difficult too.

What I may do, because I keep track of the movement is attempt to display the contributions to the team for a user, but it will be for display purposes only. I'll send you a PM when I've done it, if indeed it's feasible.
As a DBA, I can already imagine what a pain it will be if a user joins/leaves/joins/leaves etc - no quick and dirty way to achieve that in sql at least not in the denormalized table schema I've created.


Bok

EDIT: just playing with the data a little.

mysql> select a.metric1 - b.metric1 from boinc_user a join boinc_movement b on a.proj = b.proj and a.id = b.id where a.proj = 'pgrid' and b.toteam = 95 and a.id = 3550;
+-----------------------+
| a.metric1 - b.metric1 |
+-----------------------+
|       1649.8095360007 |
+-----------------------+
1 row in set (0.48 sec)

So that is the contribution since joining but that query would fail miserably if there were multiple entries in the movement table where toteam=95 or indeed where the latest one was not 95

[JohnWayne]

Sorry, didn't mean for this to be a big deal, was just wondering. AND, since I know nothing about how the stats are done, I should be keeping my mouth shut.